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	<title>Comments on: What's Your Secret?</title>
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	<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html</link>
	<description>NIGHTTIME IS FOR DREAMING. DAYLIGHT IS FOR ACTION.</description>
	<pubDate>Wed,  7 Jan 2009 01:47:35 +0000</pubDate>
	
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		<title>By: Nes</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-10006</link>
		<dc:creator>Nes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Nov 2006 21:41:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-10006</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Sure, one can believe that you may cease to exist at the point of death, but what if you're wrong. [sic]&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Ah, one of my favorite arguments. Assuming that God is as kind, loving, and forgiving as most Christians claim he is, then he would certainly have &lt;i&gt;no&lt;/i&gt; problems forgiving me for an honest and understandable mistake that I made, and would allow me into Heaven anyway (assuming that I'd &lt;i&gt;want&lt;/i&gt; to get in; it would depend on the company).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Sure, one can believe that you may cease to exist at the point of death, but what if you're wrong. [sic]</p></blockquote>
<p>Ah, one of my favorite arguments. Assuming that God is as kind, loving, and forgiving as most Christians claim he is, then he would certainly have <i>no</i> problems forgiving me for an honest and understandable mistake that I made, and would allow me into Heaven anyway (assuming that I'd <i>want</i> to get in; it would depend on the company).</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Weaver</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-10005</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Weaver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Nov 2006 20:41:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-10005</guid>
		<description>Good question.  A combination of practice and the belief that, as a matter of principle, inaccurate statements should be corrected and obnoxious statements should be..."dealt with appropriately".</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good question.  A combination of practice and the belief that, as a matter of principle, inaccurate statements should be corrected and obnoxious statements should be..."dealt with appropriately".</p>
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		<title>By: Shawn Smith</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-9996</link>
		<dc:creator>Shawn Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Nov 2006 13:27:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-9996</guid>
		<description>Alex Weaver,

Your fisking was enjoyable, but I seriously doubt that Truthgiver would be able to read your statements as anything other than an attack. So, and I ask this with sincerity and not to be a smart-aleck, what did you expect to accomplish with the fisking? Was it the practice? Was it the condescending tone of Truthgiver's remarks? I'm genuinely curious.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alex Weaver,</p>
<p>Your fisking was enjoyable, but I seriously doubt that Truthgiver would be able to read your statements as anything other than an attack. So, and I ask this with sincerity and not to be a smart-aleck, what did you expect to accomplish with the fisking? Was it the practice? Was it the condescending tone of Truthgiver's remarks? I'm genuinely curious.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Weaver</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-9989</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Weaver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Nov 2006 09:54:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-9989</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;A confession of guilt is not wrong.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I think the point is that the things being confessed here are nothing to feel guilty about.  I also think this was made perfectly clear.  Did you actually read the piece?

&lt;blockquote&gt;We all know that there is, of course, a seperation between believers and non-believers.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Unless you're referring to purely human psychological and sociological constructions...we don't "all" know any such thing.

&lt;blockquote&gt;When dealt the fact that God may exist and judge us according how we have lived our lives, sometimes a believers only way out is confession.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

There's no objective or rationally justified reason for believing God exists (I assume we have agreement that a being must necessarily exist in order to judge us?), and even if the &lt;a href="http://www.geocities.com/closetatheist/dmatrocities.htm" rel="nofollow"&gt;atrocities&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href="http://www.geocities.com/closetatheist/dmabsurdities.htm" rel="nofollow"&gt;absurdities&lt;/a&gt;, and &lt;a href="http://www.geocities.com/closetatheist/dminconsistencies.htm" rel="nofollow"&gt;inconsistencies&lt;/a&gt; in the Bible are purely the work of humans, God, if such a being as is usually meant by the term exists, has clearly created a universe filled with so much evil and suffering that for him to condemn anyone for anything would be like a chunk of pure obsidian buried in the deepest depths of a coal mine frozen under the polar ice caps of a dead planet orbiting a dying brown dwarf in intergalactic space calling the kettle black.  And believers have a way out by recognizing what I have just explained.

&lt;blockquote&gt;How do we know God exists, you ask?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

So we do.  Let's see if you really answer it; apologists usually don't provide much in the way of evidence, and emotional arguments aren't going to sway anyone who's already dedicated to reason.

&lt;blockquote&gt;Well, don't we hope of a glorious eternal resting place and fear a eternal damnation that we all know as hell.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Okay, I won't.  There, that was easy.

&lt;blockquote&gt;Sure, one can believe that you may cease to exist at the point of death, but what if you're wrong.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Then we're honestly wrong, and God, if such a being exists, has a hell of a lot of explaining to do before he has any business passing judgement on us.

&lt;blockquote&gt;Death is certain and eternity is forever.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Your point?

&lt;blockquote&gt;God gives us a promise that we can hold on to as FAITH, which is only believing in something you can't see.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Or hear, or touch, or smell, or taste, or detect with any instrument ever developed, or observe causing effects on the world clearly distinguishable from a universe that progresses through purely natural processes, or, really, find any objective evidence for the existence of (may I remind you that the burden of proof is on the affirmative?).  This statement patently &lt;a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question" rel="nofollow"&gt;begs the question&lt;/a&gt;, and you have so far failed to establish a difference between "FAITH" and wishful thinking.  And frankly, if you actually think this sentence is telling us anything that we haven't heard before, you clearly haven't been paying attention.

&lt;blockquote&gt;You may think that I am some Jesus holy roler or something and that I hope you all go to hell, but the truth is, I love all of you, and would love to see you all in Heaven someday.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I do think you're a "Jesus holy roler" [sic], since you feel the need to come here and proselytize, and frankly, given the patronizing ignorance of the previous sentence, I think a fire-and-brimstone speech or something in the style of a relatively &lt;a href="http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2006/11/creationist_email_1.php" rel="nofollow"&gt;typical Creationist email&lt;/a&gt; might be preferable.

&lt;blockquote&gt;God changed me and has blessed me in ways words cannot describe.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

How convenient.  Even if words fail, please try.  In what ways, exactly, have you been changed and blessed that not only necessitate an appeal to the supernatural to explain them but clearly implicate the Judeo-Christian God, as defined by whatever branch of religion you follow as the agent thereof?

&lt;blockquote&gt;God can do the same for you.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

God is defined as omniscient.  If so, he has my number.  If he wants to make a call I'll be happy to listen to what he has to say.

&lt;blockquote&gt;Once you get passed all the intellectual "why's" and begin to seek God, He will show up in your life.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

In other words, once you accept the premise of an argument as true--whether or not it has been established--the argument seems sound.  In other words, "once you've made up your mind, you'll stop being confused by the facts."

Incidentally.  These last few statements not only beg the question but ignore the fact that the majority of Atheists, at least in America, were at one time Christians--often conservative or even Fundamentalist Christians--and were, in fact, sincere believers.  If what you say about God is true, then why on earth would these people have come to doubt him (and what the hell was he doing asleep at the wheel when they did, if he wants people to believe in him?)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>A confession of guilt is not wrong.</p></blockquote>
<p>I think the point is that the things being confessed here are nothing to feel guilty about.  I also think this was made perfectly clear.  Did you actually read the piece?</p>
<blockquote><p>We all know that there is, of course, a seperation between believers and non-believers.</p></blockquote>
<p>Unless you're referring to purely human psychological and sociological constructions...we don't "all" know any such thing.</p>
<blockquote><p>When dealt the fact that God may exist and judge us according how we have lived our lives, sometimes a believers only way out is confession.</p></blockquote>
<p>There's no objective or rationally justified reason for believing God exists (I assume we have agreement that a being must necessarily exist in order to judge us?), and even if the <a href="http://www.geocities.com/closetatheist/dmatrocities.htm" rel="nofollow">atrocities</a>, <a href="http://www.geocities.com/closetatheist/dmabsurdities.htm" rel="nofollow">absurdities</a>, and <a href="http://www.geocities.com/closetatheist/dminconsistencies.htm" rel="nofollow">inconsistencies</a> in the Bible are purely the work of humans, God, if such a being as is usually meant by the term exists, has clearly created a universe filled with so much evil and suffering that for him to condemn anyone for anything would be like a chunk of pure obsidian buried in the deepest depths of a coal mine frozen under the polar ice caps of a dead planet orbiting a dying brown dwarf in intergalactic space calling the kettle black.  And believers have a way out by recognizing what I have just explained.</p>
<blockquote><p>How do we know God exists, you ask?</p></blockquote>
<p>So we do.  Let's see if you really answer it; apologists usually don't provide much in the way of evidence, and emotional arguments aren't going to sway anyone who's already dedicated to reason.</p>
<blockquote><p>Well, don't we hope of a glorious eternal resting place and fear a eternal damnation that we all know as hell.</p></blockquote>
<p>Okay, I won't.  There, that was easy.</p>
<blockquote><p>Sure, one can believe that you may cease to exist at the point of death, but what if you're wrong.</p></blockquote>
<p>Then we're honestly wrong, and God, if such a being exists, has a hell of a lot of explaining to do before he has any business passing judgement on us.</p>
<blockquote><p>Death is certain and eternity is forever.</p></blockquote>
<p>Your point?</p>
<blockquote><p>God gives us a promise that we can hold on to as FAITH, which is only believing in something you can't see.</p></blockquote>
<p>Or hear, or touch, or smell, or taste, or detect with any instrument ever developed, or observe causing effects on the world clearly distinguishable from a universe that progresses through purely natural processes, or, really, find any objective evidence for the existence of (may I remind you that the burden of proof is on the affirmative?).  This statement patently <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question" rel="nofollow">begs the question</a>, and you have so far failed to establish a difference between "FAITH" and wishful thinking.  And frankly, if you actually think this sentence is telling us anything that we haven't heard before, you clearly haven't been paying attention.</p>
<blockquote><p>You may think that I am some Jesus holy roler or something and that I hope you all go to hell, but the truth is, I love all of you, and would love to see you all in Heaven someday.</p></blockquote>
<p>I do think you're a "Jesus holy roler" [sic], since you feel the need to come here and proselytize, and frankly, given the patronizing ignorance of the previous sentence, I think a fire-and-brimstone speech or something in the style of a relatively <a href="http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2006/11/creationist_email_1.php" rel="nofollow">typical Creationist email</a> might be preferable.</p>
<blockquote><p>God changed me and has blessed me in ways words cannot describe.</p></blockquote>
<p>How convenient.  Even if words fail, please try.  In what ways, exactly, have you been changed and blessed that not only necessitate an appeal to the supernatural to explain them but clearly implicate the Judeo-Christian God, as defined by whatever branch of religion you follow as the agent thereof?</p>
<blockquote><p>God can do the same for you.</p></blockquote>
<p>God is defined as omniscient.  If so, he has my number.  If he wants to make a call I'll be happy to listen to what he has to say.</p>
<blockquote><p>Once you get passed all the intellectual "why's" and begin to seek God, He will show up in your life.</p></blockquote>
<p>In other words, once you accept the premise of an argument as true--whether or not it has been established--the argument seems sound.  In other words, "once you've made up your mind, you'll stop being confused by the facts."</p>
<p>Incidentally.  These last few statements not only beg the question but ignore the fact that the majority of Atheists, at least in America, were at one time Christians--often conservative or even Fundamentalist Christians--and were, in fact, sincere believers.  If what you say about God is true, then why on earth would these people have come to doubt him (and what the hell was he doing asleep at the wheel when they did, if he wants people to believe in him?)</p>
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		<title>By: Truthgiver</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-9974</link>
		<dc:creator>Truthgiver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Nov 2006 20:09:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-9974</guid>
		<description>A confession of guilt is not wrong. We all know that there is, of course, a seperation between believers and non-believers. When dealt the fact that God may exist and judge us according how we have lived our lives, sometimes a believers only way out is confession. How do we know God exists, you ask? Well, don't we hope of a glorious eternal resting place and fear a eternal damnation that we all know as hell. Sure, one can believe that you may cease to exist at the point of death, but what if you're wrong. Death is certain and eternity is forever. God gives us a promise that we can hold on to as FAITH, which is only believing in something you can't see. You may think that I am some Jesus holy roler or something and that I hope you all go to hell, but the truth is, I love all of you, and would love to see you all in Heaven someday. God changed me and has blessed me in ways words cannot describe. God can do the same for you. Once you get passed all the intellectual "why's" and begin to seek God, He will show up in your life.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A confession of guilt is not wrong. We all know that there is, of course, a seperation between believers and non-believers. When dealt the fact that God may exist and judge us according how we have lived our lives, sometimes a believers only way out is confession. How do we know God exists, you ask? Well, don't we hope of a glorious eternal resting place and fear a eternal damnation that we all know as hell. Sure, one can believe that you may cease to exist at the point of death, but what if you're wrong. Death is certain and eternity is forever. God gives us a promise that we can hold on to as FAITH, which is only believing in something you can't see. You may think that I am some Jesus holy roler or something and that I hope you all go to hell, but the truth is, I love all of you, and would love to see you all in Heaven someday. God changed me and has blessed me in ways words cannot describe. God can do the same for you. Once you get passed all the intellectual "why's" and begin to seek God, He will show up in your life.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Weaver</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-6884</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Weaver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Oct 2006 08:27:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-6884</guid>
		<description>Identifying the problem is the first step in solving it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Identifying the problem is the first step in solving it.</p>
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		<title>By: Kat</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-6865</link>
		<dc:creator>Kat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Oct 2006 23:08:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-6865</guid>
		<description>I've never been to church in my life and no one has ever explictly told me "sex before marriage is bad" but I still inexplicably feel that way.  It's particularly obvious now b/c I'm at college and it's obviously quite prevalent, but I still find myself looking upon others who do it as "bad" or sinful.  Our society is just too powerful if it can manipulate me, a free thinker, so unnoticably.  It's a subconscious thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I've never been to church in my life and no one has ever explictly told me "sex before marriage is bad" but I still inexplicably feel that way.  It's particularly obvious now b/c I'm at college and it's obviously quite prevalent, but I still find myself looking upon others who do it as "bad" or sinful.  Our society is just too powerful if it can manipulate me, a free thinker, so unnoticably.  It's a subconscious thing.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Weaver</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-6728</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Weaver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Oct 2006 02:24:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-6728</guid>
		<description>Lori: any titles you'd recommend?  My wife and I are interested in exploring it, but as we're kind of on a limited budget...

Errm, I suppose somewhere else would be appropriate for that discussion, heh.  azzathoth at yahoo dot com, if you're feeling indulgent...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lori: any titles you'd recommend?  My wife and I are interested in exploring it, but as we're kind of on a limited budget...</p>
<p>Errm, I suppose somewhere else would be appropriate for that discussion, heh.  azzathoth at yahoo dot com, if you're feeling indulgent...</p>
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		<title>By: Lori</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-6655</link>
		<dc:creator>Lori</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Oct 2006 13:24:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-6655</guid>
		<description>I love porn and I'm a girl. Sometimes, if my boyfriend is in the mood and I'm not, all I have to do is watch a few minutes of porn and I'm ready to go. Porn enriches sex lives. Now, if my boyfriend or I spent all of our time watching porn and ignoring eachother, then I would say it's a problem.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love porn and I'm a girl. Sometimes, if my boyfriend is in the mood and I'm not, all I have to do is watch a few minutes of porn and I'm ready to go. Porn enriches sex lives. Now, if my boyfriend or I spent all of our time watching porn and ignoring eachother, then I would say it's a problem.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Weaver</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-6595</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Weaver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Oct 2006 08:00:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/09/whats-your-secret.html#comment-6595</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;I think it helped save 2 of my friends marriages when the physical went south on them for a few years with their wives. If it wasn't for a few moments of self satisfaction i doubt they would have seen it through the tough times.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Not the mention the numerous couples who watch it together...or so I've heard *coughs*</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>I think it helped save 2 of my friends marriages when the physical went south on them for a few years with their wives. If it wasn't for a few moments of self satisfaction i doubt they would have seen it through the tough times.</p></blockquote>
<p>Not the mention the numerous couples who watch it together...or so I've heard *coughs*</p>
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