Comments on: Saudi Arabia's Biblical Justice http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html NIGHTTIME IS FOR DREAMING. DAYLIGHT IS FOR ACTION. Mon, 23 Jan 2012 12:09:52 -0800 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9 hourly 1 By: OMGF http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-69707 OMGF Mon, 31 Oct 2011 15:23:20 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-69707 <blockquote>Since man's original rebellion through Adam in the garden of Eden it has been impossible for man to live up to God's standard and it as impossible for us to do it now.</blockquote> Which makes it a bad standard. <blockquote>The Israelites were to be God's people on earth showing God's nature, love.</blockquote> Which is why he commanded them to commit genocide on all the surrounding peoples. <blockquote>The punishment was dramatic because God wanted them to understand just how important this was.</blockquote> And god can only indicate how important something is by using draconian measures? <blockquote>Jesus' sacrifice was to reconcile a fallen world back to it's loving Creator, because God wants an intimate relationship with everyone of us to show the love He has for us.</blockquote> Funny. He never calls, he never writes. Usually, when you want to have a relationship with someone, you talk to them. (This doesn't even address the nonsensical idea that Jesus dying in a brutal fashion somehow allows some sort of reconciliation for crimes that god had us commit in the first place - i.e. that god had to kill himself to allow himself to forgive us for crimes that he himself had us commit...truly mind boggling.) <blockquote>Also, about the 'stoning of rape victims': it was only for those who lived in cities, who could have called out and got help, and therefore could be seen as committing adultery, not being raped. Women raped in the country who could have called out, but not been heard by anyone, were not stoned to death.</blockquote> Citation please? I don't recall that being in the Bible.

Since man's original rebellion through Adam in the garden of Eden it has been impossible for man to live up to God's standard and it as impossible for us to do it now.

Which makes it a bad standard.

The Israelites were to be God's people on earth showing God's nature, love.

Which is why he commanded them to commit genocide on all the surrounding peoples.

The punishment was dramatic because God wanted them to understand just how important this was.

And god can only indicate how important something is by using draconian measures?

Jesus' sacrifice was to reconcile a fallen world back to it's loving Creator, because God wants an intimate relationship with everyone of us to show the love He has for us.

Funny. He never calls, he never writes. Usually, when you want to have a relationship with someone, you talk to them. (This doesn't even address the nonsensical idea that Jesus dying in a brutal fashion somehow allows some sort of reconciliation for crimes that god had us commit in the first place - i.e. that god had to kill himself to allow himself to forgive us for crimes that he himself had us commit...truly mind boggling.)

Also, about the 'stoning of rape victims': it was only for those who lived in cities, who could have called out and got help, and therefore could be seen as committing adultery, not being raped. Women raped in the country who could have called out, but not been heard by anyone, were not stoned to death.

Citation please? I don't recall that being in the Bible.

]]> By: Samuel McQuigg http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-69705 Samuel McQuigg Fri, 28 Oct 2011 10:39:10 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-69705 Also, about the 'stoning of rape victims': it was only for those who lived in cities, who could have called out and got help, and therefore could be seen as committing adultery, not being raped. Women raped in the country who could have called out, but not been heard by anyone, were not stoned to death. Also, about the 'stoning of rape victims': it was only for those who lived in cities, who could have called out and got help, and therefore could be seen as committing adultery, not being raped. Women raped in the country who could have called out, but not been heard by anyone, were not stoned to death.

]]> By: Samuel McQuigg http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-69704 Samuel McQuigg Fri, 28 Oct 2011 10:35:29 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-69704 In response to your paragraph: 'According to Christian theology, God deliberately laid down a set of laws - the Mosaic laws of the Old Testament - that were impossible for humans to obey perfectly, no matter how dedicated they were or how hard they tried.' God had separated out a people from the nations, the Israelites, descended from Abraham through Isaac. Since man's original rebellion through Adam in the garden of Eden it has been impossible for man to live up to God's standard and it as impossible for us to do it now. The Israelites were to be God's people on earth showing God's nature, love. The law was given to them to restrain them, not to punish them, (just as we have civil law today to restrain society) so that they would live differently from the nations around them. The punishment was dramatic because God wanted them to understand just how important this was. Jesus' sacrifice is pretty much as you described except for being for the 'inability to follow the law'. Jesus' sacrifice was to reconcile a fallen world back to it's loving Creator, because God wants an intimate relationship with everyone of us to show the love He has for us. Just as parents (should) guide their children with a set of do's and don'ts so God gave the law to guide us in the right direction and prevent, as much as possible, the natural perversion that people would fall into without those restraints and dealing with those people who chose to break the law. When asked, Jesus said the 2 main laws were to love God and our neighbours as ourselves. I've run out of space. :( In response to your paragraph: 'According to Christian theology, God deliberately laid down a set of laws - the Mosaic laws of the Old Testament - that were impossible for humans to obey perfectly, no matter how dedicated they were or how hard they tried.' God had separated out a people from the nations, the Israelites, descended from Abraham through Isaac. Since man's original rebellion through Adam in the garden of Eden it has been impossible for man to live up to God's standard and it as impossible for us to do it now. The Israelites were to be God's people on earth showing God's nature, love. The law was given to them to restrain them, not to punish them, (just as we have civil law today to restrain society) so that they would live differently from the nations around them. The punishment was dramatic because God wanted them to understand just how important this was. Jesus' sacrifice is pretty much as you described except for being for the 'inability to follow the law'. Jesus' sacrifice was to reconcile a fallen world back to it's loving Creator, because God wants an intimate relationship with everyone of us to show the love He has for us. Just as parents (should) guide their children with a set of do's and don'ts so God gave the law to guide us in the right direction and prevent, as much as possible, the natural perversion that people would fall into without those restraints and dealing with those people who chose to break the law. When asked, Jesus said the 2 main laws were to love God and our neighbours as ourselves. I've run out of space. :(

]]> By: Alex Weaver http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30902 Alex Weaver Mon, 28 Jan 2008 12:10:38 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30902 Still.... ...ah, hewwiddit. Still....

...ah, hewwiddit.

]]> By: Alex Weaver http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30751 Alex Weaver Wed, 23 Jan 2008 18:52:36 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30751 BTW: still waiting... BTW: still waiting...

]]> By: Strappado http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30608 Strappado Sun, 20 Jan 2008 11:48:29 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30608 I thought this blog post was pretty excellent. Talk about playing God! I thought this blog post was pretty excellent. Talk about playing God!

]]> By: Alex Weaver http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30501 Alex Weaver Thu, 17 Jan 2008 23:21:37 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30501 ...still waiting... (Actually, I take it back. I *think*, though I'm not sure, that there are some Islamic republics that have permitted women to serve in actual combat roles in the military or reserves...though I may be mistaken, and as far as I'm aware this is not due to egalitarianism but to perceived necessity. Anything else?) Didn't think so. ...still waiting...

(Actually, I take it back. I *think*, though I'm not sure, that there are some Islamic republics that have permitted women to serve in actual combat roles in the military or reserves...though I may be mistaken, and as far as I'm aware this is not due to egalitarianism but to perceived necessity. Anything else?)

Didn't think so.

]]> By: Alex Weaver http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30461 Alex Weaver Wed, 16 Jan 2008 22:56:46 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30461 <blockquote>Islam give women so much right that you people still have not given them til this day.</blockquote> Like what? So far, the only right I'm aware of Islam sanctifying for women is "the right to remain silent." If you want to stop your handwaving and give some examples, feel free.

Islam give women so much right that you people still have not given them til this day.

Like what?

So far, the only right I'm aware of Islam sanctifying for women is "the right to remain silent." If you want to stop your handwaving and give some examples, feel free.

]]> By: DamienSansBlog http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30459 DamienSansBlog Wed, 16 Jan 2008 22:38:50 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30459 Specifically, which freedoms and rights Islam gives to women, especially as compared to "atheist" Western nations. The right to free speech? The right to employment? The right to education? <i>Et cetera.</i> Grateful thanks. Specifically, which freedoms and rights Islam gives to women, especially as compared to "atheist" Western nations. The right to free speech? The right to employment? The right to education? Et cetera.

Grateful thanks.

]]> By: Nes http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30457 Nes Wed, 16 Jan 2008 22:33:03 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30457 Perhaps you would care to share some evidence for this claim? Perhaps you would care to share some evidence for this claim?

]]> By: Fight_for_truth http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30448 Fight_for_truth Wed, 16 Jan 2008 19:26:10 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30448 Islam give more freedom to women and give this right when others were still barbarians. Iraq and Afghanistan is political matter which the Atheist government of the West is responsible. Islam give more right to women than any religion, government, group or Atheists. Truth always triumph over falsehood. Islam give more freedom to women and give this right when others were still barbarians. Iraq and Afghanistan is political matter which the Atheist government of the West is responsible. Islam give more right to women than any religion, government, group or Atheists. Truth always triumph over falsehood.

]]> By: Ebonmuse http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30435 Ebonmuse Wed, 16 Jan 2008 13:53:56 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/01/saudi-arabias-biblical-justice.html#comment-30435 That claim is especially risible in light of the brutal injustices that women have suffered in every nation where Islam is the official religion. The cruel backwardness of Saudi Arabia or Taliban Afghanistan are the two most obvious examples: women forced to wear suffocating black shrouds in public, forbidden to hold a job or get an education, forbidden to drive, forbidden even to leave the home without the escort of a male relative, even to seek emergency medical care. Iraq is increasingly joining those two in ignominy, as violent thugs seek to enforce Islamic law on all women against their will. In countries from India to the Netherlands, female freethinkers like Ayaan Hirsi Ali and Taslima Nasrin have been harassed, hounded, and threatened by violent Muslim fanatics. Across the Middle East and even in Europe, Muslims have brutally murdered or mutilated female relatives who refuse to submit to these barbaric and backward laws. Few religions have much to boast about on the topic of women's rights, but at this moment in time, Islam is far and away the most violent, backward and oppressive one in the world when it comes to that subject. You're not fooling anyone. That claim is especially risible in light of the brutal injustices that women have suffered in every nation where Islam is the official religion. The cruel backwardness of Saudi Arabia or Taliban Afghanistan are the two most obvious examples: women forced to wear suffocating black shrouds in public, forbidden to hold a job or get an education, forbidden to drive, forbidden even to leave the home without the escort of a male relative, even to seek emergency medical care. Iraq is increasingly joining those two in ignominy, as violent thugs seek to enforce Islamic law on all women against their will. In countries from India to the Netherlands, female freethinkers like Ayaan Hirsi Ali and Taslima Nasrin have been harassed, hounded, and threatened by violent Muslim fanatics. Across the Middle East and even in Europe, Muslims have brutally murdered or mutilated female relatives who refuse to submit to these barbaric and backward laws.

Few religions have much to boast about on the topic of women's rights, but at this moment in time, Islam is far and away the most violent, backward and oppressive one in the world when it comes to that subject. You're not fooling anyone.

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