Comments on: Self-Correction http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html NIGHTTIME IS FOR DREAMING. DAYLIGHT IS FOR ACTION. Sat, 30 Aug 2008 12:56:41 +0000 By: goyo http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-33084 goyo Wed, 19 Mar 2008 15:51:23 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-33084 Konrad: You're right, it's not explicitly explained in the bible, but the trinity is one of the ways mainline christianity uses to define a cult. If the religion does not accept the doctrine of the trinity, it is labeled a cult: Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons, United Pentecostal, etc... Konrad: You're right, it's not explicitly explained in the bible, but the trinity is one of the ways mainline christianity uses to define a cult. If the religion does not accept the doctrine of the trinity, it is labeled a cult: Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons, United Pentecostal, etc...

]]> By: chiz http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-33079 chiz Wed, 19 Mar 2008 13:55:57 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-33079 Good post. You make some great points that most people do not fully understand. "The scientific method is the essence of self-correction, which is one reason it's been so wildly successful at finding out the way the world works. The system of scientific peer review and replicability exposes every idea to critical scrutiny and probing tests. Only the soundest, best-supported ideas can pass through this gauntlet. And even when wrong ideas survive initial scrutiny, they can always be overturned later by new evidence. Science's tendency to shower rewards on those who disprove conventional wisdom gives this system a built-in method of correcting its own errors." I like how you explained that. Very helpful. Thanks. Good post. You make some great points that most people do not fully understand.

"The scientific method is the essence of self-correction, which is one reason it's been so wildly successful at finding out the way the world works. The system of scientific peer review and replicability exposes every idea to critical scrutiny and probing tests. Only the soundest, best-supported ideas can pass through this gauntlet. And even when wrong ideas survive initial scrutiny, they can always be overturned later by new evidence. Science's tendency to shower rewards on those who disprove conventional wisdom gives this system a built-in method of correcting its own errors."

I like how you explained that. Very helpful. Thanks.

]]> By: konrad_arflane http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-32817 konrad_arflane Tue, 11 Mar 2008 19:53:03 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-32817 <blockquote>Yet, how can one know anything for sure about Jesus if the Bible that reveals him is wrong often or even from time to time. Is the Virgin Birth wrong? Is Jesus both God and man, or is that wrong? What about the Trinity?</blockquote> I may misremember this, but is the concept of the Trinity even explicitly biblical? I mean, of course both Father, Son and Holy Spirit are <i>mentioned</i>, to various degrees, but isn't the idea that they are one with each other, yet separate (or whatever the official self-contradiction is), a later interpretation? I seem to recall something about the divine status of Jesus being a point of some contention in the early church (even the point of schisma between Orthodox and Catholic?).

Yet, how can one know anything for sure about Jesus if the Bible that reveals him is wrong often or even from time to time. Is the Virgin Birth wrong? Is Jesus both God and man, or is that wrong? What about the Trinity?

I may misremember this, but is the concept of the Trinity even explicitly biblical? I mean, of course both Father, Son and Holy Spirit are mentioned, to various degrees, but isn't the idea that they are one with each other, yet separate (or whatever the official self-contradiction is), a later interpretation? I seem to recall something about the divine status of Jesus being a point of some contention in the early church (even the point of schisma between Orthodox and Catholic?).

]]> By: Thumpalumpacus http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-32747 Thumpalumpacus Mon, 10 Mar 2008 16:40:15 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-32747 What's notable is that when religion does self-correct, it is consistently in the direction of science, and not away -- however many centuries are required. Further is the fact that religion does not, and for the reasons Ebon outlines, cannot, generate new knowledge. Those believers who do so are often found guilty of apostasy -- an ugly idea, that. What's notable is that when religion does self-correct, it is consistently in the direction of science, and not away -- however many centuries are required. Further is the fact that religion does not, and for the reasons Ebon outlines, cannot, generate new knowledge. Those believers who do so are often found guilty of apostasy -- an ugly idea, that.

]]> By: velkyn http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-32734 velkyn Mon, 10 Mar 2008 11:15:46 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-32734 for a lovely example on how the official hierarchy just can't let go of their claims of being right: "On Monday, however, dozens of Southern Baptist leaders expressed a different view. "There is general agreement among those engaged with this issue in the scientific community," their statement says. "A minority of sincere and respected scientists offer alternate causes for global climate change other than deforestation and the burning of fossil fuels." The signatories pledged to do their part to fight global warming "without any further lingering over the basic reality of the problem or our responsibility to address it. Humans must be proactive and take responsibility for our contributions to climate change -- big and small."http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/03/10/baptist.climate/index.html Nothing like insisting that the facts don't matter and "sincerity" does. Again, cold hard reality has some ignorant Christians slowly but inevitably changing their stance, no matter how they try to excuse themselves. Such pitiful hypocrites. for a lovely example on how the official hierarchy just can't let go of their claims of being right:

"On Monday, however, dozens of Southern Baptist leaders expressed a different view.

"There is general agreement among those engaged with this issue in the scientific community," their statement says. "A minority of sincere and respected scientists offer alternate causes for global climate change other than deforestation and the burning of fossil fuels."

The signatories pledged to do their part to fight global warming "without any further lingering over the basic reality of the problem or our responsibility to address it. Humans must be proactive and take responsibility for our contributions to climate change -- big and small."http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/03/10/baptist.climate/index.html

Nothing like insisting that the facts don't matter and "sincerity" does. Again, cold hard reality has some ignorant Christians slowly but inevitably changing their stance, no matter how they try to excuse themselves. Such pitiful hypocrites.

]]> By: Ebonmuse http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-32731 Ebonmuse Mon, 10 Mar 2008 04:06:21 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-32731 And don't forget polygamy, BP - if I recall correctly, God only told the Mormons to abolish that doctrine once the federal government threatened to confiscate the church's property. Rather amazingly well-timed bit of revelation, that... And don't forget polygamy, BP - if I recall correctly, God only told the Mormons to abolish that doctrine once the federal government threatened to confiscate the church's property. Rather amazingly well-timed bit of revelation, that...

]]> By: BletchleyPark http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-32711 BletchleyPark Sun, 09 Mar 2008 17:59:15 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-32711 Wonderful post! This essay can be applied to many different religions--but wow, this has Mormonism stamped all over it. Any good thing that has ever happened in the modern Mormon church occurred when society had already corrected itself (civil rights, birth control) decades earlier. When the church was in danger of being a laughingstock for its silly 1930s prudery and provinciality, the octogenarian hierarchy finally started saying "God has told us to change course". There are no women or blacks in the highest church positions. Women are given fancy titles in the Relief Society, but any decisions that matter must be approved by the elderly leaders. Religion really is the danger Harris and Dawkins have warned us about, and Mormonism is no exception. Wonderful post! This essay can be applied to many different religions--but wow, this has Mormonism stamped all over it. Any good thing that has ever happened in the modern Mormon church occurred when society had already corrected itself (civil rights, birth control) decades earlier. When the church was in danger of being a laughingstock for its silly 1930s prudery and provinciality, the octogenarian hierarchy finally started saying "God has told us to change course". There are no women or blacks in the highest church positions. Women are given fancy titles in the Relief Society, but any decisions that matter must be approved by the elderly leaders. Religion really is the danger Harris and Dawkins have warned us about, and Mormonism is no exception.

]]> By: Jim Baerg http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-32704 Jim Baerg Sun, 09 Mar 2008 03:43:34 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-32704 Well said, but something that should be made explicit is that there is room for improvement in the methods of self-correction, particularly in government & that we should beware of people with the motivation to weaken the self-correction mechanisms in our social systems. Something worth reading on such issues is: http://www.davidbrin.com/disputationarticle1.html Well said, but something that should be made explicit is that there is room for improvement in the methods of self-correction, particularly in government & that we should beware of people with the motivation to weaken the self-correction mechanisms in our social systems.

Something worth reading on such issues is:
http://www.davidbrin.com/disputationarticle1.html

]]> By: Petrucio http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-32701 Petrucio Sat, 08 Mar 2008 23:19:20 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/03/self-correction.html#comment-32701 Awesome stuff. Awesome stuff.

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