Comments on: The Harm Psychics Do http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/06/the-harm-psychics-do.html NIGHTTIME IS FOR DREAMING. DAYLIGHT IS FOR ACTION. Wed, 17 Mar 2010 19:47:17 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9 hourly 1 By: Alex Weaver http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/06/the-harm-psychics-do.html#comment-36624 Alex Weaver Sat, 21 Jun 2008 22:23:26 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=761#comment-36624 Not that the mother "believes the child needs." Intensive behavioral therapy is, as far as I'm aware, the <i>only</i> approach with any significant track record of improving social functioning in autistics. The kid should have been getting this from about age 2, though... Not that the mother "believes the child needs." Intensive behavioral therapy is, as far as I'm aware, the only approach with any significant track record of improving social functioning in autistics. The kid should have been getting this from about age 2, though...

]]> By: sapphoq http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/06/the-harm-psychics-do.html#comment-36612 sapphoq Sat, 21 Jun 2008 15:07:33 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=761#comment-36612 The xkcd comic strip on supernatural powers says it all: claims of supernatural powers have been thoroughly refuted by scientific experiment. Those who call themselves "psychic" certainly do harm to the gullible. Now there is an autistic child home from school, a mother home caring for the child instead of working, and a school board that will not pay for the Intensive Behavioral Intervention therapy which the mother believes the child needs. http://www.citynews.ca/news/news_23845.aspx and http://www.nugget.ca/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=1079288 spike The xkcd comic strip on supernatural powers says it all: claims of supernatural powers have been thoroughly refuted by scientific experiment.

Those who call themselves "psychic" certainly do harm to the gullible.
Now there is an autistic child home from school, a mother home caring for the child instead of working, and a school board that will not pay for the Intensive Behavioral Intervention therapy which the mother believes the child needs.

http://www.citynews.ca/news/news_23845.aspx
and
http://www.nugget.ca/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=1079288

spike

]]> By: The Ridger http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/06/the-harm-psychics-do.html#comment-36606 The Ridger Sat, 21 Jun 2008 12:06:20 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=761#comment-36606 Surely it doesn't matter whether the psychic believed it - the psychic didn't call the CAS, the "educational assistant" did. Surely it doesn't matter whether the psychic believed it - the psychic didn't call the CAS, the "educational assistant" did.

]]> By: Polly http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/06/the-harm-psychics-do.html#comment-36594 Polly Fri, 20 Jun 2008 23:30:18 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=761#comment-36594 "Yes. I've taken to opening another window in Firefox & checking other websites while DA loads stuff." Ditto, except I'm using IE. "Yes. I've taken to opening another window in Firefox & checking other websites while DA loads stuff."

Ditto, except I'm using IE.

]]> By: Jim Baerg http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/06/the-harm-psychics-do.html#comment-36587 Jim Baerg Fri, 20 Jun 2008 18:01:33 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=761#comment-36587 <blockquote>Very sloooow. Any one else have this trouble?</blockquote> Yes. I've taken to opening another window in Firefox & checking other websites while DA loads stuff.

Very sloooow. Any one else have this trouble?

Yes. I've taken to opening another window in Firefox & checking other websites while DA loads stuff.

]]> By: superhappyjen http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/06/the-harm-psychics-do.html#comment-36585 superhappyjen Fri, 20 Jun 2008 17:09:48 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=761#comment-36585 I heard this woman being interviewed. She has chosen to pull her daughter out of school and is currently caring for her at home. So this isn't exactly "no harm done". <blockquote>(I'm glad to see Toronto readers offer similar thoughts on this story and roundly dismiss psychics. Way to go, Canada!)</blockquote> While I love to see Canada mentioned favourably in you post, remember that the educational assistant and school officials who cause this hoopla were also Torontonians. Not only that, they are the ones that are teaching our children! Egads! BTW: I have serious issues loading your site. As in type in your URL, go for lunch, come back. Click on the comments link to make a comment, go put the baby down for a nap, come back. Very sloooow. Any one else have this trouble? I heard this woman being interviewed. She has chosen to pull her daughter out of school and is currently caring for her at home. So this isn't exactly "no harm done".

(I'm glad to see Toronto readers offer similar thoughts on this story and roundly dismiss psychics. Way to go, Canada!)

While I love to see Canada mentioned favourably in you post, remember that the educational assistant and school officials who cause this hoopla were also Torontonians. Not only that, they are the ones that are teaching our children! Egads!

BTW: I have serious issues loading your site. As in type in your URL, go for lunch, come back. Click on the comments link to make a comment, go put the baby down for a nap, come back. Very sloooow. Any one else have this trouble?

]]> By: OMGF http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/06/the-harm-psychics-do.html#comment-36580 OMGF Fri, 20 Jun 2008 14:36:25 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=761#comment-36580 <blockquote>What if the phony psychic had said that Victoria was at dire risk of being kidnapped or harmed and that the authorities wouldn't listen? Would this endlessly gullible educational assistant have taken it upon herself to spirit the girl away?</blockquote> Which, ironically enough, would have proven the prediction true.

What if the phony psychic had said that Victoria was at dire risk of being kidnapped or harmed and that the authorities wouldn't listen? Would this endlessly gullible educational assistant have taken it upon herself to spirit the girl away?

Which, ironically enough, would have proven the prediction true.

]]> By: Ray http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/06/the-harm-psychics-do.html#comment-36576 Ray Fri, 20 Jun 2008 08:50:40 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=761#comment-36576 Here's the problem with a psychic - whenever they get it wrong, it's not that they were wrong, it's that the person who heard the message misinterpreted it. So the "v" in the story was clearly not <em>that</em> "v" but a different one. And the psychic is home and dry. I don't care how plausible they seem, psychics are utter bullshit artists. Here's the problem with a psychic - whenever they get it wrong, it's not that they were wrong, it's that the person who heard the message misinterpreted it. So the "v" in the story was clearly not that "v" but a different one. And the psychic is home and dry.

I don't care how plausible they seem, psychics are utter bullshit artists.

]]> By: Ebonmuse http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/06/the-harm-psychics-do.html#comment-36574 Ebonmuse Fri, 20 Jun 2008 04:12:30 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=761#comment-36574 <blockquote>"phony pyschic"?...are you implying that there are legitimate ones?</blockquote> Not at all. That's why I dislike just writing the term "psychic", without the adjective - that seems too much like validating their delusions to me.

"phony pyschic"?...are you implying that there are legitimate ones?

Not at all. That's why I dislike just writing the term "psychic", without the adjective - that seems too much like validating their delusions to me.

]]> By: Christopher http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/06/the-harm-psychics-do.html#comment-36573 Christopher Fri, 20 Jun 2008 03:49:07 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=761#comment-36573 It's hard to believe anyone still takes these fools seriously, but nonetheless we do live in such a world - even major world leaders have been known to consult with these mystics before making policy decisions. Thus causing me to call into question the wisdom of not just the "psychics," but of much our society (as they seem to place a lot of faith in them). It's hard to believe anyone still takes these fools seriously, but nonetheless we do live in such a world - even major world leaders have been known to consult with these mystics before making policy decisions. Thus causing me to call into question the wisdom of not just the "psychics," but of much our society (as they seem to place a lot of faith in them).

]]> By: Chris http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/06/the-harm-psychics-do.html#comment-36572 Chris Fri, 20 Jun 2008 03:45:33 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=761#comment-36572 Two observations: 1. If the mother had actually had a boyfriend in that age range he would probably be in jail right now. His existence would be sufficient corroboration of the psychic's statement. 2. IANAL, but I think that proving that the person knew the statement is false is often a difficult part of fraud suits and prosecutions. (In civil fraud suits at least you don't have to prove it beyond a reasonable doubt.) Deluded people are likely to get off on the ground that they believed what they said. (There's always the possibility that investigation will reveal a smoking gun proving that this particular psychic was a knowing fraud and not a deluded believer, though.) You also have the difficulty that in order to sue for fraud, you have to show that you *reasonably* relied on the fraud's statements as the basis for some action and were harmed as a result. (I don't know if this applies to criminal fraud.) The same statement can't be so ridiculous that the fraud must have known it was false, but plausible enough that the victim could reasonably have relied on it; so in practice, the fraud must have *superior* knowledge of the subject matter, so that they can know they're lying while it's reasonable for the victim to believe them. Two observations:

1. If the mother had actually had a boyfriend in that age range he would probably be in jail right now. His existence would be sufficient corroboration of the psychic's statement.

2. IANAL, but I think that proving that the person knew the statement is false is often a difficult part of fraud suits and prosecutions. (In civil fraud suits at least you don't have to prove it beyond a reasonable doubt.) Deluded people are likely to get off on the ground that they believed what they said. (There's always the possibility that investigation will reveal a smoking gun proving that this particular psychic was a knowing fraud and not a deluded believer, though.)

You also have the difficulty that in order to sue for fraud, you have to show that you *reasonably* relied on the fraud's statements as the basis for some action and were harmed as a result. (I don't know if this applies to criminal fraud.) The same statement can't be so ridiculous that the fraud must have known it was false, but plausible enough that the victim could reasonably have relied on it; so in practice, the fraud must have *superior* knowledge of the subject matter, so that they can know they're lying while it's reasonable for the victim to believe them.

]]> By: Thropmorton Clackenhammer http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/06/the-harm-psychics-do.html#comment-36570 Thropmorton Clackenhammer Fri, 20 Jun 2008 01:01:30 +0000 http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=761#comment-36570 "phony pyschic"?...are you implying that there are legitimate ones? "phony pyschic"?...are you implying that there are legitimate ones?

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