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	<title>Comments on: In Which I Am Attacked By a U.S. Senator</title>
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	<description>NIGHTTIME IS FOR DREAMING. DAYLIGHT IS FOR ACTION.</description>
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		<title>By: Dakota</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/10/elizabeth-dole-anti-atheist-bigot.html#comment-53097</link>
		<dc:creator>Dakota</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Dec 2009 02:44:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=850#comment-53097</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve recently discovered this site so I have a lot of catching up to do. For any others who are reading this article for the first time, I thought I&#039;d post the news that Kay Hagan did indeed win the election.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I've recently discovered this site so I have a lot of catching up to do. For any others who are reading this article for the first time, I thought I'd post the news that Kay Hagan did indeed win the election.</p>
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		<title>By: bestonnet</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/10/elizabeth-dole-anti-atheist-bigot.html#comment-40141</link>
		<dc:creator>bestonnet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Oct 2008 05:25:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=850#comment-40141</guid>
		<description>John Hodges:&lt;blockquote&gt;I support &quot;Candidate List&quot;, where each candidate lists all the other candidates in order of THAT candidate&#039;s preference, i.e. &quot;If I don&#039;t win a seat, I&#039;d prefer all the votes I got to be transferred to candidate B; if they don&#039;t get enough to win a seat, then transfer my votes to candidate C&quot;, and so forth.&lt;/blockquote&gt;That&#039;s been tried and has led to some &lt;a href=&quot;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outdoor_Recreation_Party&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;strange&lt;/a&gt; &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2004/10/10/1097406425742.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;outcomes&lt;/a&gt; that aren&#039;t even close to representative of the population.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John Hodges:<br />
<blockquote>I support "Candidate List", where each candidate lists all the other candidates in order of THAT candidate's preference, i.e. "If I don't win a seat, I'd prefer all the votes I got to be transferred to candidate B; if they don't get enough to win a seat, then transfer my votes to candidate C", and so forth.</p></blockquote>
<p>That's been tried and has led to some <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outdoor_Recreation_Party" rel="nofollow">strange</a> <a href="http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2004/10/10/1097406425742.html" rel="nofollow">outcomes</a> that aren't even close to representative of the population.</p>
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		<title>By: John Hodges</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/10/elizabeth-dole-anti-atheist-bigot.html#comment-40124</link>
		<dc:creator>John Hodges</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Oct 2008 01:20:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=850#comment-40124</guid>
		<description>Besides Freethought, election reform is &quot;my other worthy cause&quot;... Three cheers for Proportional Representation! For districts with small numbers of seats, or elections that must be for a single seat, such as Mayor, Governor, President, I support &quot;Candidate List&quot;, where each candidate lists all the other candidates in order of THAT candidate&#039;s preference, i.e. &quot;If I don&#039;t win a seat, I&#039;d prefer all the votes I got to be transferred to candidate B; if they don&#039;t get enough to win a seat, then transfer my votes to candidate C&quot;, and so forth. If there are multiple candidates such that no one gets the necessary number, then the candidates&#039; lists and vote totals are the input data for an STV or Condorcet process, to select the winner(s). The advantage of this is  that ballots are simple; voters don&#039;t have to rank a dozen candidates, election administrators don&#039;t have to deal with great numbers of ranked ballots, you can use paper ballots counted by hand, and still get Proportional Representation/Condorcet, eliminating the spoiler effect, allowing independent/nonpartisan candndaites, and so forth.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Besides Freethought, election reform is "my other worthy cause"... Three cheers for Proportional Representation! For districts with small numbers of seats, or elections that must be for a single seat, such as Mayor, Governor, President, I support "Candidate List", where each candidate lists all the other candidates in order of THAT candidate's preference, i.e. "If I don't win a seat, I'd prefer all the votes I got to be transferred to candidate B; if they don't get enough to win a seat, then transfer my votes to candidate C", and so forth. If there are multiple candidates such that no one gets the necessary number, then the candidates' lists and vote totals are the input data for an STV or Condorcet process, to select the winner(s). The advantage of this is  that ballots are simple; voters don't have to rank a dozen candidates, election administrators don't have to deal with great numbers of ranked ballots, you can use paper ballots counted by hand, and still get Proportional Representation/Condorcet, eliminating the spoiler effect, allowing independent/nonpartisan candndaites, and so forth.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Weaver</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/10/elizabeth-dole-anti-atheist-bigot.html#comment-39831</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Weaver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 18 Oct 2008 03:01:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=850#comment-39831</guid>
		<description>Donated.  Sent this message to Elizabeth Dole via the email form on her site:

&lt;blockquote&gt;Senator Dole,

Like many others, I am an American citizen, a patriot, a loving father, a good husband, an all-around decent human being - and an atheist.  I am appalled and ashamed at the small-minded and vicious bigotry your campaign has recently displayed in its attacks on your opponent, Kay Hagan, as it comprises outright slander against the entire community of American atheists.  This sort of bigotry is shameful and un-American.  I can see no reason why a candidate capable of standing on the basis of her record and policies would descend to what is essentially the modern-day equivalent of attacking one&#039;s opponent as a &quot;n*gger-lover&quot; - as if recognizing that members of minorities are human beings and Americans were somehow shameful.  Based on your campaign&#039;s conduct with regard to Mrs. Hagan&#039;s decision to attend a fundraiser organizaed by the Kaminers, I have little doubt that, had this race occurred 50 years earlier, your campaign would have done exactly that.

As a citizen of California, I have no direct stake in this race, for which your campaign&#039;s bigotry makes me exceedingly glad.  As a show of solidarity for a candidate and human being who took a courageous stand in embracing the American principles of liberty, tolerance, and the unity of disparate groups working for a common purpose, and to join many members of my community in publicly declaring that pandering to bigots is not a defensible strategy for winning elections or for anything else, I have made a monetary contribution to Kay Hagan&#039;s campaign.  I know I am not alone.

I am exceedingly glad to see that prediction sites are giving her good chances of winning, and I hope you and your campaign get the message that appealing to the worst in the American character, and pandering to bigotry against minority groups, are neither viable nor acceptable in this great nation.

Sincerely, 
Alex Weaver&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Donated.  Sent this message to Elizabeth Dole via the email form on her site:</p>
<blockquote><p>Senator Dole,</p>
<p>Like many others, I am an American citizen, a patriot, a loving father, a good husband, an all-around decent human being - and an atheist.  I am appalled and ashamed at the small-minded and vicious bigotry your campaign has recently displayed in its attacks on your opponent, Kay Hagan, as it comprises outright slander against the entire community of American atheists.  This sort of bigotry is shameful and un-American.  I can see no reason why a candidate capable of standing on the basis of her record and policies would descend to what is essentially the modern-day equivalent of attacking one's opponent as a "n*gger-lover" - as if recognizing that members of minorities are human beings and Americans were somehow shameful.  Based on your campaign's conduct with regard to Mrs. Hagan's decision to attend a fundraiser organizaed by the Kaminers, I have little doubt that, had this race occurred 50 years earlier, your campaign would have done exactly that.</p>
<p>As a citizen of California, I have no direct stake in this race, for which your campaign's bigotry makes me exceedingly glad.  As a show of solidarity for a candidate and human being who took a courageous stand in embracing the American principles of liberty, tolerance, and the unity of disparate groups working for a common purpose, and to join many members of my community in publicly declaring that pandering to bigots is not a defensible strategy for winning elections or for anything else, I have made a monetary contribution to Kay Hagan's campaign.  I know I am not alone.</p>
<p>I am exceedingly glad to see that prediction sites are giving her good chances of winning, and I hope you and your campaign get the message that appealing to the worst in the American character, and pandering to bigotry against minority groups, are neither viable nor acceptable in this great nation.</p>
<p>Sincerely,<br />
Alex Weaver</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: stillwaters</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/10/elizabeth-dole-anti-atheist-bigot.html#comment-39820</link>
		<dc:creator>stillwaters</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 21:23:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=850#comment-39820</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m late getting to this post, but it looks like I&#039;m in for another donation to the gracious Ms. Hagan.

I&#039;ve been enjoying watching the polls and seeing Ms. Dole &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.pollster.com/polls/nc/08-nc-sen-ge-dvh.php&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;go down in flames&lt;/a&gt;. Desparate indeed. I think I&#039;ll &lt;a href=&quot;https://secure.actblue.com/entity/fundraisers/18560&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;throw her an anvil&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I'm late getting to this post, but it looks like I'm in for another donation to the gracious Ms. Hagan.</p>
<p>I've been enjoying watching the polls and seeing Ms. Dole <a href="http://www.pollster.com/polls/nc/08-nc-sen-ge-dvh.php" rel="nofollow">go down in flames</a>. Desparate indeed. I think I'll <a href="https://secure.actblue.com/entity/fundraisers/18560" rel="nofollow">throw her an anvil</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Weaver</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/10/elizabeth-dole-anti-atheist-bigot.html#comment-39746</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Weaver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Oct 2008 02:47:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=850#comment-39746</guid>
		<description>Although it also makes a point of insisting that Hagan herself is not an atheist, as if that would make her look better, so it&#039;s mixed...but also treats &quot;atheist&quot; and &quot;anti-American&quot; as different categories.  Hmm.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Although it also makes a point of insisting that Hagan herself is not an atheist, as if that would make her look better, so it's mixed...but also treats "atheist" and "anti-American" as different categories.  Hmm.</p>
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		<title>By: Lynet</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/10/elizabeth-dole-anti-atheist-bigot.html#comment-39745</link>
		<dc:creator>Lynet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Oct 2008 01:02:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=850#comment-39745</guid>
		<description>Wow!  The editorial doesn&#039;t come right out and say it, but it directly implies that there is bigotry in attacking a candidate for attending a fundraiser organised by atheists.  We have progress!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow!  The editorial doesn't come right out and say it, but it directly implies that there is bigotry in attacking a candidate for attending a fundraiser organised by atheists.  We have progress!</p>
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		<title>By: Ebonmuse</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/10/elizabeth-dole-anti-atheist-bigot.html#comment-39742</link>
		<dc:creator>Ebonmuse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Oct 2008 23:08:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=850#comment-39742</guid>
		<description>For the record: the &lt;i&gt;Fayetteville Observer&lt;/i&gt; has editorialized in opposition to Dole&#039;s bigot-baiting, in &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.fayobserver.com/article?id=307439&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Dole’s new ads set the low mark in negative political campaigning&lt;/a&gt;.

&lt;blockquote&gt;
A broadcast ad targeting her opponent, Democratic state Sen. Kay Hagan, shows Dole ratcheting up her rhetoric, and probably winning the honor, so far, of fielding the nastiest, most misleading, negative ad of the campaign. Here&#039;s part of the ad that portrays Hagan as a godless liberal: 

&quot;Godless Americans Political Action Committee is a left-wing organization...

&quot;They actively support political candidates who are atheists and who also support their liberal agenda to remove &#039;under God&#039; from the Pledge of Allegiance and force the Boy Scouts to accept atheists and homosexuals as troop leaders.&quot;

Dole&#039;s campaign made the same charge in a widely-distributed mailer. 

Yes, it&#039;s true, as the ad states, Hagan did attend a fundraiser in September hosted by author Wendy Kaminer and her husband Woody Kaplan. Kaplan serves on the board of the Godless Americans PAC, whose agenda includes putting atheists in office and removing the pledge from schools.

But that doesn&#039;t make Hagan an atheist or anti-American. Hagan is an elder at the First Presbyterian Church in Greensboro and she does not support removing the &quot;Under God&quot; from the Pledge of Allegiance.
&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For the record: the <i>Fayetteville Observer</i> has editorialized in opposition to Dole's bigot-baiting, in <a href="http://www.fayobserver.com/article?id=307439" rel="nofollow">Dole’s new ads set the low mark in negative political campaigning</a>.</p>
<blockquote><p>
A broadcast ad targeting her opponent, Democratic state Sen. Kay Hagan, shows Dole ratcheting up her rhetoric, and probably winning the honor, so far, of fielding the nastiest, most misleading, negative ad of the campaign. Here's part of the ad that portrays Hagan as a godless liberal: </p>
<p>"Godless Americans Political Action Committee is a left-wing organization...</p>
<p>"They actively support political candidates who are atheists and who also support their liberal agenda to remove 'under God' from the Pledge of Allegiance and force the Boy Scouts to accept atheists and homosexuals as troop leaders."</p>
<p>Dole's campaign made the same charge in a widely-distributed mailer. </p>
<p>Yes, it's true, as the ad states, Hagan did attend a fundraiser in September hosted by author Wendy Kaminer and her husband Woody Kaplan. Kaplan serves on the board of the Godless Americans PAC, whose agenda includes putting atheists in office and removing the pledge from schools.</p>
<p>But that doesn't make Hagan an atheist or anti-American. Hagan is an elder at the First Presbyterian Church in Greensboro and she does not support removing the "Under God" from the Pledge of Allegiance.
</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: noncarborundum</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/10/elizabeth-dole-anti-atheist-bigot.html#comment-39693</link>
		<dc:creator>noncarborundum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 19:04:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=850#comment-39693</guid>
		<description>Dole has just persuaded me to make Hagan&#039;s campaign $50.00 richer.  Funny how that works.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dole has just persuaded me to make Hagan's campaign $50.00 richer.  Funny how that works.</p>
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		<title>By: Damien R. S.</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/10/elizabeth-dole-anti-atheist-bigot.html#comment-39626</link>
		<dc:creator>Damien R. S.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Oct 2008 03:22:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=850#comment-39626</guid>
		<description>I think there&#039;s a rather large leap from &quot;our voting system is pessimal&quot; to &quot;politics doesn&#039;t work&quot;, especially given all the polities relatively happy with their governments.  Better to say that Americans are structurally and/or culturally bad at government (e.g. our voting, the government structure itself, our habit of electing politicians who say government doesn&#039;t work and proceed to run a non-working government...)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think there's a rather large leap from "our voting system is pessimal" to "politics doesn't work", especially given all the polities relatively happy with their governments.  Better to say that Americans are structurally and/or culturally bad at government (e.g. our voting, the government structure itself, our habit of electing politicians who say government doesn't work and proceed to run a non-working government...)</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Baerg</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/10/elizabeth-dole-anti-atheist-bigot.html#comment-39624</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Baerg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Oct 2008 01:56:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=850#comment-39624</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Democracy, in the end, is always a case of two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Actually it isn&#039;t. A country is a democracy only so long as there is broad consensus on any issues worth killing &amp; dieing for.

If the vote is over whether to kill some of the voters, any who would be killed will take up arms rather than accept the results of such a vote.

See http://dougmuder.blogspot.com/2008/05/pirate-treasure-why-oil-and-democracy.html
for an discussion of the effects of this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Democracy, in the end, is always a case of two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner.</p></blockquote>
<p>Actually it isn't. A country is a democracy only so long as there is broad consensus on any issues worth killing &amp; dieing for.</p>
<p>If the vote is over whether to kill some of the voters, any who would be killed will take up arms rather than accept the results of such a vote.</p>
<p>See <a href="http://dougmuder.blogspot.com/2008/05/pirate-treasure-why-oil-and-democracy.html" rel="nofollow">http://dougmuder.blogspot.com/2008/05/pirate-treasure-why-oil-and-democracy.html</a><br />
for an discussion of the effects of this.</p>
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		<title>By: Darren</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/10/elizabeth-dole-anti-atheist-bigot.html#comment-39619</link>
		<dc:creator>Darren</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Oct 2008 23:04:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=850#comment-39619</guid>
		<description>Interesting. Hadn&#039;t really looked into range voting before. I think all this just highlights the fundamental inability of politics (i.e. coercive government) to provide solutions, unlike the market where everyone votes with their dollars for exactly what they want and there are a wide range of options at various qualities and prices. Democracy, in the end, is always a case of two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting. Hadn't really looked into range voting before. I think all this just highlights the fundamental inability of politics (i.e. coercive government) to provide solutions, unlike the market where everyone votes with their dollars for exactly what they want and there are a wide range of options at various qualities and prices. Democracy, in the end, is always a case of two wolves and a sheep voting on what to have for dinner.</p>
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