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	<title>Comments on: Down to Earth</title>
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	<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/11/down-to-earth.html</link>
	<description>NIGHTTIME IS FOR DREAMING. DAYLIGHT IS FOR ACTION.</description>
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		<title>By: Leum</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/11/down-to-earth.html#comment-41544</link>
		<dc:creator>Leum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Nov 2008 19:32:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=882#comment-41544</guid>
		<description>True, we&#039;re in the unfortunate position of having an economy based on the theory that people will irrationally buy more and more and more, an economy in which long-term thinking is punished, an economy which must grow in order to not die. This is inherently unstable, of course, and will crash. Hopefully someone in office will realize this and...*laughs hysterically at own naïveté*</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>True, we're in the unfortunate position of having an economy based on the theory that people will irrationally buy more and more and more, an economy in which long-term thinking is punished, an economy which must grow in order to not die. This is inherently unstable, of course, and will crash. Hopefully someone in office will realize this and...*laughs hysterically at own naïveté*</p>
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		<title>By: Christopher</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/11/down-to-earth.html#comment-41527</link>
		<dc:creator>Christopher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Nov 2008 08:32:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=882#comment-41527</guid>
		<description>bassmanpete,

&lt;blockquote&gt;Our whole education system is designed to turn out factory &amp; office fodder who are also consumers. It&#039;s what keeps the whole economy going but most people don&#039;t realise it.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

So true - I wasn&#039;t in college more than 2 years when I became dissolusioned with the system: yes, I finished just to say I got my degree and get what I once thought of as a decent job, but it wasn&#039;t long before I realized that I was acting as little more than a puppet to push other peoples products and ideas into the marketplace.

Thus the reason I moved out of the city and back to my little border town and, with the help of some associates, established an alternative socio-economic system - one that doesn&#039;t prize the production/consumption of products so much as the continued use of existing resources.  None of of make all that much money (I get between $40 and $50 thousand on an excellent year), but barter and salvage goes a long way towards closing that gap.  But our social order doesn&#039;t want people to realize this: should people come to the knowledge that they can live without excessive consumption, people wouldn&#039;t work so hard to generate the income used to purchase all those extra goods - goods that manufacturers tend to produce on the cheap and sell at inflated prices.  Should people learn to be happy without the excessive consumerism, the whole mainstream economy would completely unravel!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>bassmanpete,</p>
<blockquote><p>Our whole education system is designed to turn out factory &amp; office fodder who are also consumers. It's what keeps the whole economy going but most people don't realise it.</p></blockquote>
<p>So true - I wasn't in college more than 2 years when I became dissolusioned with the system: yes, I finished just to say I got my degree and get what I once thought of as a decent job, but it wasn't long before I realized that I was acting as little more than a puppet to push other peoples products and ideas into the marketplace.</p>
<p>Thus the reason I moved out of the city and back to my little border town and, with the help of some associates, established an alternative socio-economic system - one that doesn't prize the production/consumption of products so much as the continued use of existing resources.  None of of make all that much money (I get between $40 and $50 thousand on an excellent year), but barter and salvage goes a long way towards closing that gap.  But our social order doesn't want people to realize this: should people come to the knowledge that they can live without excessive consumption, people wouldn't work so hard to generate the income used to purchase all those extra goods - goods that manufacturers tend to produce on the cheap and sell at inflated prices.  Should people learn to be happy without the excessive consumerism, the whole mainstream economy would completely unravel!</p>
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		<title>By: Freidenker</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/11/down-to-earth.html#comment-41487</link>
		<dc:creator>Freidenker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 18:49:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=882#comment-41487</guid>
		<description>I think the unifying factor that makes everyone happy is the somewhat vague term &quot;accomplishment&quot;. I give a lot of weight to evolutionary theory when addressing general issues such as &quot;happiness&quot;, &quot;fear&quot; etc. Since the pursuit of happiness is practically a universal &quot;habit&quot;, you could easily agree that it has evolutionary origins. It gets trickier for humans as we often do not operate for rewards, but to potential rewards. A lot of people might think they&#039;re happy or even be &quot;mistakenly happy&quot; just because they&#039;re sure they got what they needed or wanted.

I think the only way to be happy for a long span of time is to constantly make sure that tomorrow is somewhat different than today. People can enjoy a lot of earthly things, but they&#039;ll never feel satisfied without purpose, and purpose can only be maintained so long as you haven&#039;t achieved what you&#039;re aiming to do. That&#039;s why I think even the wealthiest and hedonistic individuals can feel completely void of meaning, simply because they have nothing new to aspire to (and it doesn&#039;t have to be more wealth, just something different).

Luckily, I take pleasure in learning as much as I can, and knowing the severe limits of my intelligence, I know I&#039;ll never run out of things to learn. I may not be as content or as happy as I&#039;d like, but I will always have purpose.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the unifying factor that makes everyone happy is the somewhat vague term "accomplishment". I give a lot of weight to evolutionary theory when addressing general issues such as "happiness", "fear" etc. Since the pursuit of happiness is practically a universal "habit", you could easily agree that it has evolutionary origins. It gets trickier for humans as we often do not operate for rewards, but to potential rewards. A lot of people might think they're happy or even be "mistakenly happy" just because they're sure they got what they needed or wanted.</p>
<p>I think the only way to be happy for a long span of time is to constantly make sure that tomorrow is somewhat different than today. People can enjoy a lot of earthly things, but they'll never feel satisfied without purpose, and purpose can only be maintained so long as you haven't achieved what you're aiming to do. That's why I think even the wealthiest and hedonistic individuals can feel completely void of meaning, simply because they have nothing new to aspire to (and it doesn't have to be more wealth, just something different).</p>
<p>Luckily, I take pleasure in learning as much as I can, and knowing the severe limits of my intelligence, I know I'll never run out of things to learn. I may not be as content or as happy as I'd like, but I will always have purpose.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Bowen</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/11/down-to-earth.html#comment-41482</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Bowen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 11:15:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=882#comment-41482</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Is Hugh Hefner happier than Bill Gates?&lt;/blockquote&gt; Have you seen the three women he shares his mansion with? He damn well ought to be!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Is Hugh Hefner happier than Bill Gates?</p></blockquote>
<p> Have you seen the three women he shares his mansion with? He damn well ought to be!</p>
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		<title>By: bassmanpete</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/11/down-to-earth.html#comment-41481</link>
		<dc:creator>bassmanpete</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 06:59:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=882#comment-41481</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Those who market the product don&#039;t care if you run that treadmill for the rest of your life; in fact, they&#039;re banking on us doing exactly that. As long as we keep buying, they&#039;ll keep telling us we need something, even if we already have a dozen of them. &quot;Disposable culture&quot; is an incredible oxymoron, but that&#039;s the reality we&#039;ve come to face.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Our whole education system is designed to turn out factory &amp; office fodder who are also consumers. It&#039;s what keeps the whole economy going but most people don&#039;t realise it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Those who market the product don't care if you run that treadmill for the rest of your life; in fact, they're banking on us doing exactly that. As long as we keep buying, they'll keep telling us we need something, even if we already have a dozen of them. "Disposable culture" is an incredible oxymoron, but that's the reality we've come to face.</p></blockquote>
<p>Our whole education system is designed to turn out factory &amp; office fodder who are also consumers. It's what keeps the whole economy going but most people don't realise it.</p>
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		<title>By: abusedbypenguins</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/11/down-to-earth.html#comment-41478</link>
		<dc:creator>abusedbypenguins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 03:10:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=882#comment-41478</guid>
		<description>Is Hugh Hefner happier than Bill Gates?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is Hugh Hefner happier than Bill Gates?</p>
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		<title>By: bbk</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/11/down-to-earth.html#comment-41475</link>
		<dc:creator>bbk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 00:06:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=882#comment-41475</guid>
		<description>Yes, it&#039;s true that there is a huge body of data from around the world that indicates that beyond a certain income, people stop getting any happier with more money.  But the same data also shows that wealth still has a stronger correlation than anything else.  Above a middle class income, the overriding hurdle to happiness seems to be a simple question of mental health.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, it's true that there is a huge body of data from around the world that indicates that beyond a certain income, people stop getting any happier with more money.  But the same data also shows that wealth still has a stronger correlation than anything else.  Above a middle class income, the overriding hurdle to happiness seems to be a simple question of mental health.</p>
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		<title>By: Leum</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/11/down-to-earth.html#comment-41466</link>
		<dc:creator>Leum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 21:00:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=882#comment-41466</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s not that money doesn&#039;t buy happiness, it&#039;s that once you have enough money to have a good job, nice home, food, etc additional money won&#039;t make you any happier. The same studies have also revealed that once you reach that point, knowing that other people are relatively poorer than you will make you happier, but only for a short time. Once you hit the sufficient funds point, more money won&#039;t do much.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It's not that money doesn't buy happiness, it's that once you have enough money to have a good job, nice home, food, etc additional money won't make you any happier. The same studies have also revealed that once you reach that point, knowing that other people are relatively poorer than you will make you happier, but only for a short time. Once you hit the sufficient funds point, more money won't do much.</p>
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		<title>By: Mathew Wilder</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/11/down-to-earth.html#comment-41455</link>
		<dc:creator>Mathew Wilder</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 16:53:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=882#comment-41455</guid>
		<description>@ Entomologista: Exactly.(cf. Maslow&#039;s Heirarchy of Needs)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Entomologista: Exactly.(cf. Maslow's Heirarchy of Needs)</p>
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		<title>By: Entomologista</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/11/down-to-earth.html#comment-41454</link>
		<dc:creator>Entomologista</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 15:58:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=882#comment-41454</guid>
		<description>My mom always says there&#039;s no shame in being poor, but there&#039;s nothing noble about it either. And I&#039;ve found that the people who say money doesn&#039;t bring happiness already have a good job, a nice home, and enough to eat. Money gets you security, which I find to be essential to happiness.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My mom always says there's no shame in being poor, but there's nothing noble about it either. And I've found that the people who say money doesn't bring happiness already have a good job, a nice home, and enough to eat. Money gets you security, which I find to be essential to happiness.</p>
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		<title>By: Christopher</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/11/down-to-earth.html#comment-41424</link>
		<dc:creator>Christopher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 21:11:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=882#comment-41424</guid>
		<description>Brad,

&lt;blockquote&gt;While freedom is an invigorating feeling for me, isolation inevitably bores me.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Who said anything about isolation?  While you may be living far from mainstream civilization, you&#039;re never completely cut off from other people (although there are some days I wish I could do that, but I digress...).

&lt;blockquote&gt;Plus, I don&#039;t find dependence to be in and of itself bad, nor do I think dependence is always equivalent to being controlled. &lt;/blockquote&gt;

It is 9 out of 10 times - the less dependent you are on outside powers, the lesser the chance that a social order can get its hooks in you. 

&lt;blockquote&gt;Personally, I don&#039;t make my philosophy to aim for happiness. I just sail by my windy whimsical nature wherever it goes, whether into storm or calm, horizon or harbor, Arctic or Tropics, etc. Bliss, hatred, depression, mania - I&#039;ll welcome it all, because why do any other?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

To quote the cheshire cat &quot;If you don&#039;t know where you&#039;re going, any path will get you there.&quot;  While I do love the winds of chaos, I like to harness them to my own ends rather than get blown about by them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brad,</p>
<blockquote><p>While freedom is an invigorating feeling for me, isolation inevitably bores me.</p></blockquote>
<p>Who said anything about isolation?  While you may be living far from mainstream civilization, you're never completely cut off from other people (although there are some days I wish I could do that, but I digress...).</p>
<blockquote><p>Plus, I don't find dependence to be in and of itself bad, nor do I think dependence is always equivalent to being controlled. </p></blockquote>
<p>It is 9 out of 10 times - the less dependent you are on outside powers, the lesser the chance that a social order can get its hooks in you. </p>
<blockquote><p>Personally, I don't make my philosophy to aim for happiness. I just sail by my windy whimsical nature wherever it goes, whether into storm or calm, horizon or harbor, Arctic or Tropics, etc. Bliss, hatred, depression, mania - I'll welcome it all, because why do any other?</p></blockquote>
<p>To quote the cheshire cat "If you don't know where you're going, any path will get you there."  While I do love the winds of chaos, I like to harness them to my own ends rather than get blown about by them.</p>
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		<title>By: Ebonmuse</title>
		<link>http://www.daylightatheism.org/2008/11/down-to-earth.html#comment-41412</link>
		<dc:creator>Ebonmuse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 05:31:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.daylightatheism.org/?p=882#comment-41412</guid>
		<description>Incidentally, if you&#039;re looking to clean out your old books: I can recommend &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.paperbackswap.com/index.php&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Paperback Swap&lt;/a&gt;, a very cool idea for a site that my fiancee turned me on to.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Incidentally, if you're looking to clean out your old books: I can recommend <a href="http://www.paperbackswap.com/index.php" rel="nofollow">Paperback Swap</a>, a very cool idea for a site that my fiancee turned me on to.</p>
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